Jennifer: 0:00

about dating, while obviously that it should be fun, this is my motto tell everyone about relationships. It's not about finding the right person. It's about being the right person. Divorce does not have to be a disaster, it can be a start of a new beginning.

Melissa Bright: 0:16

Welcome to the bright side of life, a podcast where people share their personal stories of struggles, pain and grief. But through all of that, they are still able to find the joys in life. Hello, hello, everyone, and welcome to this week's episode of the bright side of life. I'm your host, Melissa Bright. And today I have someone on the show that I feel every woman and man needs to have on their shoulder at all times. Today, I have Jennifer hurvitz. She is a dating coach and relationship expert, and also a certified divorce specialist. Jennifer helps people understand what a happy divorce can look like and how to dip their toes back into the dating world. And she has a couple more accolades. She is a podcaster, a blogger and also an author. She wrote the book woulda, coulda, shoulda a divorce, a divorce coaches guide to staying married, which was chosen as one of the best books to read with your partner for a healthy relationship. So Jennifer, thank you. How are you doing today?

Jennifer: 1:41

Glad to be here. I just think beforehand that I was listening to your podcast and I love your name. And I love your energy. I'm, I'm excited to be here. I am having

Melissa Bright: 1:50

Yes, I am so excited. And you know, I believe we met on clubhouse, but also your Instagram is just so fun. And I'm like, I got to talk to this girl cuz you make some of the funniest relationship like memes reels, all this stuff. And I'm like, I gotta talk to her.

Jennifer: 2:08

Well it's supposed to be fun. I mean, it is supposed to be fun. But you know, it doesn't always start that way. Right? I mean, it's tough. We go. It's tough. It's, you know, and it wasn't always easy for me crazy, right. So that's why I love your podcast.

Melissa Bright: 2:21

And we'll Thank you. And that's kind of what we're going to talk about. So there's several different stages. And I know my listeners, they could be in the dating phase. They could be married, they could be going through a divorce, they could be on the other side of divorce and starting to look at dating. So we're going to kind of cover all these topics, because I know you've done all of them. But let's first start with your your own story. So I do know that you have been divorced since 2014. And yeah. But yeah. If we can kind of talk about like, what your marriage was like, and kind of what made it go bad and what made the final decision to finally end in divorce.

Jennifer: 3:09

Okay, well, so my, my marriage is suffering. I always say this. I had a different marriage slash divorce than most I want to say most people. I ended my divorce happily. Now I tell people, I'm happily divorced. I'm not happy to be divorced. Does that make sense? Oh, yeah. Okay. Okay. So I'm not start this here. I'm not. I'm not regretting that I got divorced. I'm not in love with my ex husband, but I love him. We're amicable. We are we co parent like rock stars. I call him my husband. And we are best friends. So that is much different than most people. divorce. It's a much different situation. A lot of my clients are in high conflict divorces. They hate their exes. They can't be in the same room. They can't breed. They can't talk. I mean, my divorce is very different. I'm lucky, very lucky. Now people say to me, Well, if you're such great friends, why don't you just get back together with them? Absolutely not. Okay. There's a reason I got divorced. I think I had to get divorced, to be where I am now. Okay. So that's what it could have shown on a divorce coach, a guy coaches guide to stay married was I think I had to, I had to end my marriage to be happy and get to this spot where I can now teach people how to be married and how to do it. Right. So I did a TED talk. I didn't happen because of COVID. But the title of the TED talk was what my divorce taught me about marriage, right. So I can help anybody stay married, because I fucked it up so badly that I know exactly what mistakes people are like, Oh my god, Jen. I can't believe it. I'm like, but it's true. Right? So if I would have done things differently in my marriage, I'm telling you, I would I would still be married. Okay. I completely held myself accountable for the mistakes I made. I was going holds himself accountable for the mistakes he made. And we can both move into our new relationships. Boy for now for almost four and a half years. We're happy. Not all the time, because relationships take work, but all relationships take work right friendships, relationships with your kids, with your co workers. And, you know, I think if your expectations are such that they're going to take work then you know, right, yeah. So yeah, so my first book is one happy divorce hold the bullshit. I mean, that was my, that was my kids Arctic book. That was my book, like, Oh, I got divorced, and I got it, you know? And then my second book is what it could have shut up. But did I answer your question? Kind of? I don't know if I did.

Melissa Bright: 5:37

Yeah, no, you definitely did. So what would you say was? Did you guys both decide on to get a divorce? Was it agreeable? Or did somebody come to the other person and say that they wanted to divorce?

Jennifer: 5:49

This is the other thing too. I always tell people. This is where people are like, they're gonna call you up and be like, She's crazy. We have two boys. My boys are nine and 11. At the time. I think we moved way too quickly into into our divorce. I think that we, we should have done more work. I think had I know now what I had, I know then when I know now, I would have stayed longer. I would have done more work. I would have done more work on myself inside the marriage before I sign those papers. The divorce grass is not greener. I didn't know. We both that we both thought it was gonna be easier. More fun. No, Mike, my heart didn't flutter when the grass door opened at the end of the day. That's not a reason to get divorced. Right? Look, my caveat is if you're in an abusive, physically abusive emotionally, physically, you get divorced, right? I mean, you get to where you don't stay in an unhappy marriage for your kids. That's not right. Right. But you stay. You stay if you need. If there's work to be done, and you can fix it. You fix it. You try you do your best, right? We did not. We're both like, Oh, fuck it. Yeah, my sex isn't good. You know, I mean, like, and I think we both thought we did the work. I think we both recently were in couples therapy. And we thought like, we tried. Yeah. But then when we realized, like, people around us was still married, and their relationships were frickin awful, like, horrific. And my husband was like, chanted we know, right? We're both like, Oh, my God, but at that point, it was too late. Right? You know, it was both like we both are like, happily divorced at that point. Like, we were actually like, now what do we do? We can't we're not going to go back and we don't right. It's over. Right?

Melissa Bright: 7:33

Yeah. Wow. You You said so many important things right there that I feel that I want to reiterate if you are in any of those type of relationships, where it's physical, mental, any of that abuse, absolutely get the hell out get out. But if there is something simple, because and this is just a lot of people know this that my boyfriend is not an affectionate person. Okay. And I am very affectionate and he's touched physical touch in your I'm physical touch. Okay, he is and he is I want to buy you all the gifts in the world as a an every single day of his life. I get a new gift like it What is your love language? It's not but I'm getting used to it. And but the thing is, is it took me a long time to realize that it was the family that he grew up in that wasn't overly you know, affectionate. But I always took it as What's wrong with me? What's wrong with me? What's wrong with me? Right. And through a lot of work, a lot of arguments, we have came leaps and bounds for me to finally understand. It isn't me. That is just how chills I have the chills. Yeah. And you. And that was not worth me throwing our relationship away because of something that he literally cannot. He can work on it. Yes. But he's not just going to snap his fingers one day and just be like, I want to be all over you now. And that's really important to to note, because I feel like some people do just want to throw it away on just maybe. I don't want to say petty because it is important, especially if it's your love language. Right,

Jennifer: 9:12

right. But it can be in the fact that you can hold it you read you recognize that right? Yeah. Recognize you say Look, I know I need to I need physical touch. He knows any physical touch. We recognize that. Okay, we're going to own it. We're going to work on it and we're not going to throw our our federal relationship is we have a great foundation here. Why would we throw everything away? And that? Yeah, he's he's not abusive. He's not a drug addict. He's not a nurse, please. Right. Yeah. Like that's what happened to me. Like I was like, okay, you know, what am I I cannot even tell you now look. Like you said in my first book, I had a huge tube, please. I'm not saying to stay in America. Like I don't know, people were calling you. Oh my god. She's saying no, no, no, no, get out of it. You know, don't be so right one For the hills, right? Yep. But yeah,

Melissa Bright: 10:03

yeah, I just love that you, you did take ownership of stuff because him and I both it took a very, very humble conversation for about three hours of us both admitting stuff that we needed to work on and we broke up for about three months. And finally we realized, we don't we don't want to be broke up. But it takes both of us to admit our faults. And then what are we going to do from here? You know, and I feel like that's kind of a secret recipe, but we can kind of get into all that about like, all this stuff, because I have a million questions that asked me Okay, so the one question I do have, and that what you said is people are like, Oh, why don't you get back with your husband after you realize it after you did realize, like, wow, we should have done more work than Why did you not go back?

Jennifer: 10:54

I think it took us both. much longer. I it wasn't like a quick thing was like, Yeah, I got divorced in five, but five or six months later, I was like, Oh, really? No, no, we still had it. It wasn't it wasn't like we could we were everything was roses and, and unicorns, through the divorce process. And in Charlotte, North Carolina, you have to be separated for a full year. Before you can file.

Melissa Bright: 11:15

Oh,

Jennifer: 11:16

and we decided, my husband, I decided that we were going to do we were going to nest. So seven years ago when I got divorced, no one knew of no nesting ones. So I created that doing nesting is no I don't Okay. Oh, good. Okay, so I created it seven. No, before it was even a cool thing. That thing is when the kids stay in the family home. And the adults move out. And they either share of space if they but if they can't afford it, or they get to separate spaces, which nobody does, because it's expensive. But my husband and I shared an apartment. And we moved in and out. So so like I was there one week, and then I would move to the apartment, he would go the next week. I look what this happens. The best thing about this is not only First of all, you have to be completely selfless, to be able to do this because you are putting yourself in a in an apartment with your ex. Now you're not living there at the same time, remember, but just sharing a two bedroom apartment, right? But you're actually moving in and out. So you're the one that learns what it's like to move every week, right? You forget your undies, you're screwed. You forget you can't go back to the nest. So I was like, Oh my god, this is what my boys are gonna have to do for the rest of their lives. Yeah, they're gonna be moving houses like this. And I was like, what a wake up call for me. Right? Right. I was like, Oh, my God, this is what I'm doing to them. always makes me. But yeah, so we nested for as long as we could be nested for six months. Right? And that because we have two separate addresses. You have to be in two separate entities. We only took us 18 months then. Oh my god for divorce.

Melissa Bright: 12:55

Yeah. That is such a great concept. The nesting thing. Holy crap. I have never even heard of that. And instead of moving the kids, you guys do that now. Wow. Because you work though. If If you get like a pretty amicable if you kind of exactly cuz it's Yeah, some people are probably like, Oh, hell to

Jennifer: 13:17

the No. Like I would come back to the nest. And it would be like a disaster. because he'd been there with the kids for a week because we do week on week off. But you have to remember he's he's never been a single dad before. He's working 40 hours a week and taking care of a nine year old 11 year old and I'd come home and I'd be like, and I clean the house. And I'd be but that's like how we

Melissa Bright: 13:36

Yeah, now. That is amazing. So you have to be separated. Is that to like encourage people to like, hey, really think about it. full year. That's, that's smart.

Jennifer: 13:48

Yep. And it was I mean, we did we did. So for 18 months, we are separated. So by the time we finally filed, we're both we're pretty sure that like, and the kids were settled at that point. And no, at that point, we moved to two houses. And you know, they were and we did it like really? I mean, we put our kids first, which is what I always say, you know, it's putting your ego aside putting your kids first thought about the kids.

Melissa Bright: 14:13

Yeah, definitely. Yeah. Okay, so we've, we've, we've been through all the divorce and everything. And before we kind of go into the rest of it. Were you a relationship? expert dating? No, no, for any of this. This is how this transpired. Right. So, you know,

Jennifer: 14:31

like in the theme of your show, that's the theme of your show. I was a DJ. So I was a DJ. DJ for 15 years before I got married. Seriously? Yeah. And then when I had two boys, I gave it all up to raise my kids. So when I got divorced, like most like a lot of stay at home moms, I had nothing. Yeah, I had no career I had no you know, nothing. I had no degree. I was like I you know, family child ecology who was my major. I was a social worker. So that was gone. But now it's helping. Um, you know, so I kind of got divorced. I was like, What am I going to do? What am I going to do? So, I wrote a book actually started by writing a blog start. It's called the truth hurvitz. Like, the truth hurts, right? by name. I wrote a blog and I was like, no one's gonna read this, who's gonna read this? And next thing I know, people were reading it and they were like, Oh my god, she's saying exactly what I'm thinking and blah, blah, blah. I make it quick. And then producers wife in LA, read it. And I wrote a screenplay from it, which started shopping a TV show, and the TV show, it's just all started. It was crazy. Crazy. So then I went, got my divorce certifications, specialists. So I was a divorce certified divorce specialist for a while and then, you know, as I think is we all evolve and change are we kind of changed with our, so this January, after being in a relationship for four years, I'm like, I kind of can't do divorce anymore. You know, like, it's kind of like, I'm, I've kind of evolved. It's been seven years, and I feel like I need to be in a positive space. So now I'm coaching relationships and dating and I love it and it's happy and

Melissa Bright: 16:05

not that, you know, right. But that's amazing. Wow. Okay, so we got, we got to go back to the DJ. What kind of DJ were you? Sorry. I'm intrigued. So what kind of DJ were you?

Jennifer: 16:20

Okay, so I was a dancer. I danced my whole life. So I was a dance instructor and then I taught ballroom and all that good stuff and hip hop, and I DJ like bar mitzvahs and weddings and corporate parties and

Melissa Bright: 16:30

Okay, gotcha that I did a little. Yeah, that okay. I was wondering cuz I know how to do that also. Yes, I my, my great friend taught me how to use cdjs. And Yep, I my name was DJ Mel bright. My boy likes to tease me. I swear to God. Yeah, I was obsessed with it. I wanted to be a DJ. I have been to like all the major shows of like, dead mouse, Armin Van Buren like,

Jennifer: 16:56

yeah, like you hardcore. No, I was like, I was like Adam Sandler and the Wedding Singer.

Melissa Bright: 17:01

Yeah.

Jennifer: 17:02

I don't like stood on chairs at the YMCA and stuff. Like kids threw two throws at me during breakfast. Yeah, that was me.

Melissa Bright: 17:07

I did. Awesome. I'm really old. Oh, so like, Macarena. That was? Yeah.

Jennifer: 17:13

Honey, you're 1520 years younger than me.

Melissa Bright: 17:16

That's okay. I'm old. That's okay. Okay, so that's how all of this transpired. And I do have to ask you before we move further, what the hell is a certified divorce specialist? What does that mean? How do you get certified? What makes you want to become one?

Jennifer: 17:32

I don't know. You know what, this is the truth of the matter. You don't need like I it's like a life coach. I feel like none of us need to be, you know, have letters behind your name to be, I want to try to pick up where we left off. So

Melissa Bright: 17:45

that the letters behind your name,

Jennifer: 17:47

right. So you want to just ask me that question again. Yeah. And then you can cut it in. Okay.

Melissa Bright: 17:50

So what is a certified divorce specialist? What motivates somebody to be one of those? And how the hell does that? Yeah, I never heard of this. So I'm like,

Jennifer: 18:00

What is that? It's funny. There's like a certified divorce specialist. There's a certified divorce coach, there's a certified there are like, you know, so I think that what really happens is that, you know, I don't think we need letters behind our name, per se, to be, you know, a specialist or an expert in something as long as you're a little bit better than someone else in your field. I think you're, that makes us an expert. Right? Yeah. But with that said, there are all these programs all over the place where you can get certified to be specialists, or coaches, or whatever. So um, there was a certified divorce specialist thing, and someone had it in Florida. I'm like, you know what, I just go get some letters behind. My name is Lindsey what happens? And honestly, you know, I honestly don't even put it on things anymore. Because I'm gonna be honest, I'm not so sure. You know, it's just another it's just another course another thing in there. And it just, it gave me some more information. I learned some stuff that I decided that was,

Melissa Bright: 18:54

what was your biggest takeaway of learning about that? About the course that you took? Like, Oh, yeah.

Jennifer: 19:00

What's cool about it? This is cool. I didn't it was in four parts. So it was like emotional, legal. Real Estate. And look at me, I'm like, Look, I did a really great job here. Good job, Jen. Something was like, Oh, I know. Mental health. Oh, boy. Yeah. Right. So like, I mental health is my jam. Like, that's my jam. Right? That was my major in school, whatever. I know nothing about real estate, like if you, but that's the thing. Like it was like, a weekend course. Right. You can't get enough about real estate and legals. I mean, could I count this out my jam? So and it's also I've no, no, I mean, come on. So someone comes to me, but if someone comes to me and wants to hire me, immediately, I say, I'm not legal. I'm not. Don't hit don't give me your money. And I send them to people who know what they're doing. Right? Yeah, but I mean, I'll coach you all day long. But also I when people come to me to coach them, if they need someone, you know, a therapist. I know immediately and I'm like, I'm not sure Listen, I can coach you through the divorce process. I'd love to coach you, but I'm not gonna. Yeah. Okay, not that person is gonna take your money.

Melissa Bright: 20:06

Right? That makes sense. And you like you said, you know what your jam is if you're like, let's talk about the mental health. That's kind of how I am. Let's talk about the mental health aspects of divorce and about data and all that stuff. Yes, that's me. I'm your girl.

Jennifer: 20:18

Right? And if I if you want an online dating profile written or you want me to help take your pictures, or you want me to find you a guy, or you know, talk all day long. I love it. Yes. But I'm not gonna talk about your finances and who to give what debit? That's not. Yeah, no, no, no, any. And if you go to a coach, and any coach tells you, and you need to run it, right, they're not they're not certified for that. Yeah.

Melissa Bright: 20:40

Okay, we're gonna kind of like, as we're moving on to talk about, like, tips on dating and all that stuff. Where did you decide? And how did you know that you were ready to start dating your boyfriend who's now been dating four and a half years. So what made you ready? We'll start there.

Jennifer: 20:58

I'll tell you what made me ready. It was a line of losers. I'll tell you no, I, again, I think we learn from our mistakes. And I made a lot of them. I made a lot of them. And I feel like when you're coming, you're not divorced, or you know,

Melissa Bright: 21:15

I've never been married. Oh, yeah, I haven't been married or divorced. Yeah.

Jennifer: 21:20

I think that when you come out of a divorce, you think you know everything. You're in a horrible space. You're it's just like, it's like a death. It really masks that of a death rate, the the like, stages of death and grieving and one of the whole thing. And you think you're okay, and you're just not. And I said, tell my clients all the time. Please, please, please wait a year, please just give me one year, you'll, everything will look differently in a year Don't rush into dating. And everyone's like, No, I'm fine. I'm good. I got this other. Like, you really don't. You really don't. Cuz, I mean, but you're not gonna listen. No, you're not. So I didn't. I didn't listen to anyone. And I jumped right into dating. I jumped right into me in a blending families, which I don't do either. We could talk about that later. But yeah, I made huge mistakes. So my goal as a dating coach is to help my clients, like navigate the muddy dating waters, right? Because I was there. When I was there. It was terrific. And it's and it's supposed to be fun, right? And there really are like, really good things you can do when there are tips. And to make it easy. I just, and every coach is different, and every relationship is different. It's not one size fits all.

Melissa Bright: 22:30

Yep, exactly. And it's all depending on your experience. You had a really amicable divorce. Yes. So you are coming at it maybe from a different angle in terms of divorcing or somebody else a different coach could maybe have a crazy ex husband or the divorce are really bad. And they're like, you'd need to do this or don't do this or whatever. So in terms of you being a dating coach, do you do you coach people at all different stages Do you do like after divorce? A young let's say 25 year old that just

Jennifer: 23:06

my favorite? Oh, really? I don't have any clients right now that are like this, but like our pre, but those are the ones who are like, Oh my god, I'm 30 years old. I need to have babies now I need to give I'm like, Whoa, like, those are like the ones I wish I could just do a whole like group of 30 year olds who are like freaking out because I want to be like, No, no, like, I just want to, like, get into that. Because I'm so like, those are like, that group is like I would just coach them all because they don't need to rush. They don't the pressure that they have from their parents and their religious backgrounds and their you know, their other friends who have worn you know, like I've worn 12 different bridesmaids dresses. I'm gonna be I'm like, Oh my God. I just I want them all to take a deep breath. Right? Yeah, they're okay. They're okay. 35 is the new

Melissa Bright: 23:57

you know? Yes, it is.

Jennifer: 24:00

Yes, it is. Right. I mean, like I'm like just and a lot of coaches are different. Like there's other coaches are like no by 30 you need to be married. I'm like, ah, like you always want to like no, no girls, you're okay. NO and NO. And you know, the whole the game playing thing. The whole like that three days this and four dates that and you've got I don't I don't do that either. That's not how I coach. Right? So

Melissa Bright: 24:23

I watched I watched one of your videos that you're talking about. Oh my gosh, what were you talking about? You were talking about the no bullshit you were tall enough. Don't say how you feel Yeah. I cannot even imagine at the age of 35 right now trying to even be in the dating world. Like it makes me sick to my stomach. Especially with with how far I have. We have came now and our relationship like five years put in a lot of work a lot of hours. I can't imagine so if if I was I don't want to say me hype. Theoretically, a 30 year old does come to you. She feels like oh my God, my mom tells me like, I gotta get going. I need to have kids soon. What are what are some tips that you can tell these 30 year olds that feel like they're just running out of time?

Jennifer: 25:17

Okay, so this is what I always tell my. And this is hard because it's expensive. It's really expensive to save your eggs. It's expensive. But a lot of my clients come to me and they're like, at first I say, you know, I don't know their financial situation, right? But if there is a way if they're, honestly if their parents are so hell bent on them getting married, or getting having kids, I would go there mom and dad say, look, if you're so crazy about me having kids, help me freeze my eggs Give me the Give me the money. I need dragon. Because here's the thing, the only reason, the only reason that you're rushing this process, which is what I did, which is what my goal is to have babies, and I get it, because there is there is that. I mean, the older you are, the higher chances have all kinds of defects I understand and that trust me, I get it, right. 30 years old. 30. But look at you can have if you if your eggs are frozen, you can have kids 245 it takes every pressure off of every kid their kids at 30 years old. You're guys, you're young, your kids. Yep. I'm telling you, the guys, it takes pressure off the guys. It takes pressure off, everybody, are you. That's what I mean. If you can freeze your eggs, your life would be like a different life. You wouldn't be up to date and just have just relax and chill out. I was sitting next to her on the plane once. And I was working on something for a public speaking event I was doing and she kind of was whatever slip, what do you do? And I'm like I told her. And she's like, Oh my god, I'm 28. You tell me what to do. I just had my mom and like I said, Hi, I'm trying to tell you what to do. You're gonna relax First of all, and you're 28 Honey, you're 28 I hit two babies. No, I'm like, you'll be fine. Like, no, I'm not gonna be fine. My mom says if I don't have kids, by the time I'm 30 I'm going to get breast cancer, ovarian cancer. I'm like, Can you imagine the stress? And I'm like, Yeah, because that was me. Right. And now I'm 40 at this point, and I'm getting divorced. Yeah. Something else?

Melissa Bright: 27:18

Okay, so first of all, you probably well, I did tell you this. I had my daughter when I was 16. Yeah. And I did not marry the her father. We were going to he did propose, but it didn't end up happening, which is fine. But something that really makes me sad to hear about people, 30 year olds being rushed to have kids to get married. What the hell? What happens when you fucking have a kid with the wrong person and you get married? Just because like, why would you? Why would a mother why would parents do that to rush them? And put pressure like that's fucked up? Do you know how much I pride myself on not being married yet where other people think I should have already been married. I'm like, I would have been divorced four times over if I would have married this. People.

Jennifer: 28:03

I'm like, I don't know what it is. As a parent, you want your kids and this is what I think. I think parents want their kids to be taken care of. They want their daughters especially their daughters to be taken care of. So sexes, their daughters to be taken care of to be financially supported. They, they want Matt have to. Some of them don't wanna have to worry about their kids anymore, right? But here's the thing. It's way more difficult to handle someone like me who gets divorced at 41. My parents are, you know, than it is to take care of a kid who's 35 and not married yet? Yeah, I look at my boys. And I'm like, Don't you even think? Don't even think about putting a ring on a girl's finger until you're 35 Don't even think about it. Yep. Yeah. No, use your whole life to live. That's what I'm teaching my kids, I teach my kids, you have a life, to travel to do to make mistakes, to fix those mistakes, to meet new people to discover who you are to grow. Because it's just it's difficult. It's it's really just a different world.

Melissa Bright: 29:01

Right? So we love talking about mental health. And so I really want to dive into this a few because a little bit of my backstory basically from my 20s until I was 30. I didn't really have super serious relationships. I just kind of dated here and there. And then I started dating my boyfriend Brandon, whom whom I have known for 18 years we went to high school together rekindled whatever I am so I had to be in a relationship to learn a lot about myself and what some things that happened in my past in terms of like, how I was how I was raised, not having patience, getting anger angry very quickly. When you don't have a boyfriend. None of this stuff comes comes up so you don't really know you think you're this like oh, I'm just perfect. And now that I've been in a relationship, I have learned that I am sensitive as fuck like way sensitive. Anything that he says to me that might just be a little bit something, I think like, Oh my god, he thinks this and he's like, What? How did you even get that? So I say, I say all of that, because him and I have went through so much and we have learned so much about ourselves. But sometimes you need that relationship to figure out, how do you handle stress? How do you handle criticism? How do you handle financial things? And a mental health is a big part of it. Because if people have had a really, really hard childhood, not saying that mine was super hard, but however they were raised, that's going to be brought into the relationship.

Jennifer: 30:39

Of course, of course, childhood traumas, of course. Yeah, it depends. That changes your reactivity, which we're talking about when you get mad real quickly, right, all that. But as you're talking, I'm listening, and I'm going I'm shaking my head. So I was like, Yes, yes. Because the other thing that's different with you and Brandon or Brandon, Brandon, Brandon, is he sticking around? Yep. Okay, so he's choosing you know, he's, he's, he's staying there. And he's learning along with you right now. So when you get quick, or when you're reactive, your reactivity levels high and you and you're impulsive, or you do get sad or you're sensitive. He's not running for the door. Okay, that's another thing. You're not either you're choosing each other. Okay? You don't see that happening very often with when you first start dating. And that's why my video the other day, when I was like, You need to find someone who wants you. That's what I need. You need to find someone who your who's willing to stay the course with you and just try it out. Now, look, you're lucky because Brandon said, I'm going to stay here. We're going to do this together. I don't care about your childhood, whatever. It comes with you. It's the baggage I have and help you unpack. Yep. Right? We're gonna unpack it together. You've got some shit. I got some shit. Let's do this. Right. But he's sticking around. And that's my boyfriend too. He's stuck around. Yeah, I got tons of shit, right? Tons of shit. I got on pack for tiger. He's still here. So. And that says a lot about him. Yeah. And it says a lot about you and Brandon. And those relationships that I wish that on every girl who sits across the table from someone on a first a second or third date is that the guy looks at her and says, You know what? Let's just try this. I don't know where it's gonna go. But I don't want to date anybody else, then. Yeah, it's our fourth date. But you know what? I'm going to go off my apps. And let's just see. Yeah, there's nothing wrong with that. Right? That's how this that's the only way that this is going to work? Yeah. Because then the girl's insecurities go down. Her trust level goes up. And you know, what if it lasts for three weeks? Oh, well, if it lasts for four months, awesome if it lasts for five years.

Melissa Bright: 32:40

Great. Whoo. Right. And that that's another thing you said in one of your videos. And that's so huge, as you said, maybe one of your mistakes that you made before is when you would start dating these people, you didn't tell them upfront what you wanted. Right. And that was a lot of my issues. As I knew maybe I was ready for a long term relationship. That person was totally just ready to get into the bed. And we were on two totally different playing fields, but I just didn't say anything. And then I was set up for failure.

Jennifer: 33:12

Of course, because I was scared and nervous. I was scared. I was gonna lose him. I didn't want to. I didn't want to be like that girl. I don't want to say look needy. I don't want to look like you know, oh my god, she's crazy. What kind of girl says that? But you know what, like, as I got older, and I realized, look, fuck him. You know? Like, I'm not crazy. I'm gonna say what I want. And I would show up for days, I'd be like, Look, here's what I'm looking for. I'm looking for long term relationship. And if that's not what you're looking for, then we don't need to meet again. Right? And the guy would be like, I'd be like, I'm not being you know, I'm just being honest.

Melissa Bright: 33:43

Again, then you're cutting through the bullshit it's like okay, move on. Like why it when you look back on it, it makes such sense. Like why would we not say that because the person that if they do if that's what they're looking for cool, then let's try this out. But if not, move on. You're gonna save yourself so much freakin writing.

Jennifer: 34:01

Absolutely. And like there's no reason to play games. And so a lot of these guys I'm not putting down into the coaches Look, everyone coaches differently and there's different coach for everybody. And I love that about coaches. But a lot of coaches say you know, like, you know, don't lay your cards on the table holds you up close to your chest or chest or whatever and play you know, you have to play hard to get i think that that is just men are what they want a woman to want them. Okay, I don't care what I've I've, I've asked men, men 100 I've interviewed them. I've talked to them. And then I don't care what they want you to watch them. We want to be wanted. Everybody wants to be wanted no one else they want. They want to be needed. I'm not being sexist, I'm not being at all. grama here, men, men want to be needed. They want you to need you're like hey, you know, but sincerely that like oh, I need you to take out my trash but like and appreciate them. Right? Right? Instead of saying like, Hey, I appreciate you know, Hey, thanks for taking out the trash. You know you say you know I'm Brenda, I really appreciate you today. Like, I really appreciate you just showing up for me. Yeah, sincerely and honestly, I appreciate you. Right? Totally different than saying, Hey, thanks for taking out the trash. Right? Exactly.

Melissa Bright: 35:14

Okay, whenever you first start, let's say, dating coach whenever you first start one of your coaching sessions, and I know this can look different because everybody has has different goals, I'm assuming, but what do you what do you start? Yeah. What do you start with? Like, what is he? Is there a common theme, whatever. Thank you to better help for sponsoring this podcast. I have been using better help for almost a year now. And the progress that I have made in my mental health has been incredible. I just want to tell you, my listeners a little bit about better help to see if it might be a great fit for you. Their mission is making professional counseling accessible, affordable and convenient. So anyone who struggles with life challenges can get help anywhere, anytime they offer four ways to get counseling, from video sessions, phone calls to live chat and messaging. It's also available worldwide, you will be matched with your counselor and 24 hours or less better help offers a broad expertise in their network. So it provides users with access to specialists, they might not be able to find locally, financial aid is also available for those who qualify. So visit better help.com slash bright side of life, that's better help.com slash bright side of life, join over 500,000 people taking charge of their mental health with the help of an experienced professional. And for your first month, you're going to receive 10% off by being a listener of the bright side of life. So let them know that I sent you by using the link better help.com forward slash bright side of life. That's better help.com forward slash b r i g h t side of life. The link will also be in the description section of this episode.

Jennifer: 37:03

We start with a list, we make a list of non negotiables. So I'm a big fan are non negotiables. And I hold you to them. So I have a tough coach, do I hold you to him? So if you come to me and you say, Jen, I do not want to date a guy that lives out of Charlotte, I'm not long distance, I'm no long distance for me. And I say, okay, you make a list of Nat things like that, like, I don't want to date a guy with kids. I want to date a guy that has red hair, whatever it is, but I get specific, like my non negotiable list is like, we're getting like to the your age to like if you're, if you're, you know, dating after divorce, and you're getting really specific, like, we generally make a little more general for 25, whatever. But if you come back to me, we do your dating profile. I mean, whatever. And we put you up on the dating apps, that whatever Two weeks later, you come back and you're like, I met this guy in New York. He's the hottest thing I love him. We're like, Oh, that's that's, um, you told me? No, you know, I'll be like you said you don't want to align just there's no, I changed my mind. I changed my mind. I'm like, bullshit you did. You told me when we first met long distance didn't work for you in the past. We talked about it in detail. And the girl, whatever the girls are, I was like, No, no, no, I'm like, yeah, now here, we're gonna make a deal. You can see this guy, whatever, I'll give you two weeks and they always come back to me. They're like you. I should have listened to you. It was the worst thing ever. I'm like, hold on. So yeah, I told you. I never told you I would say

Melissa Bright: 38:31

okay, right. Of course, of course. But you know, so we do a non negotiable list. That's first. Yeah, that is really smart. So if somebody wasn't gonna hire a dating coach, do you do Yes. Do it do

Jennifer: 38:44

it do that's where they should do? Yes. And then that helps you when you're going through your like method using match or smore or filter off or any of these apps. There's really Oh, there's some ever heard of the ship? Or you know what I'll do I'll give you there are some new ones. I'm just gonna put them out. There are new ones that like are insanely amazing and I'm not getting any kickbacks but like the meatery filter off smore hip hinge I like okay Cupid I still like but like when you're doing you have this non negotiable list in front of you. So when you're filling up filling out your like on all your criteria you follow it right so like if you know that you want to didn't want to date someone that lives in Kentucky you make your range zero to five you don't change it because you're gonna like are like we keep getting the whole world like everyone in the world I don't care what their kids I don't care what guy I don't like that I get a call. I'm like, Girl I told you no. I don't care if you have to get I don't want the best is when they say I don't want to date anyone kids. And then they call me they're like I met this guy. And he has six to six children. I'm like

Melissa Bright: 39:57

yeah. Oh my goodness. Yeah. Okay, so I know we're kind of bouncing around a little bit. Your guests are like, What is going on? No, it's all good. Because I'm starting to think of I'm starting to think of different things. So if somebody just has went through divorce, and they're at the stage that they think that they are ready to start dating, what is something? Like I said, there's all kinds of different value variables, but somebody is coming to you, Jennifer, I have been divorced for about seven months now. And I think I want to start getting getting into dating, what are going to be some things that you tell them to look for? Or how do they know they're ready? Things like

Jennifer: 40:40

that. So I mean, you know, here's the thing. First of all, you are the only one that knows if you're ready. Right. There are different situations. If you've been in a sexless, loveless marriage for five years. You're ready. Right? You're ready? Yeah, um, if you have done some work on yourself, and that's really important. Like, if you can sit in a room by yourself for a weekend, and enjoy being alone. You're ready. You know, like, I mean, if you're not dating for sport, you're pretty much ready. Like, I mean, I was I was there like, on Tinder, like, it was a pastime for me, like, I was like, I was bored. So I pick up Tinder and I like left and right, left. I mean, like, I was not ready to date.

Melissa Bright: 41:25

Yeah.

Jennifer: 41:27

I think that those are like certain things that you just have to be able to sit in your own space, and you can go to yoga by yourself and you don't mind, you know, having a snack at the bar or going for coffee and sitting by yourself. If you feel it's okay to be alone. It's okay to be alone. I did not feel that way. I was like, I cannot be alone. I can't sit here. I'm, you know, the kids would go to my husband's house. And the first thing I would do was, you know, like, have to call a friend and like, you know, be at their house, you're not ready to date. If you're filling a void. You're ready to date. If you're looking to meet new people or and that's another thing too. I never call them dates. I call them meets, you're going to meet someone new today. Yeah, we're gonna meet someone new. Yes, it takes the pressure off. It's supposed to be fun, right? And it's not fun. You shouldn't be doing it. Right.

Melissa Bright: 42:19

That's a really good point that you make about about spending time alone, because that's a what a lot of people do is, I can't be alone, I can't be alone. And if you are trying to fill that void, you are going to set yourself up for failure, because you're probably going to fall really fast for them. Because you're looking for somebody to be their whole world. You want them. And you kind of have your own life and your own thing, too. Yeah,

Jennifer: 42:48

I can tell you a story I did that I balanced this. And the first relationship after divorce is all most of the time worse than the divorce itself. So I can tell you, because you plan the divorce, you know what's coming unless like, the guy comes on and says I'm leaving you typically even then you will have to go through steps to get divorce. Right? But when you're like, relationship is right out in the first relationship. It's a year, it's six months, whatever it is, and the guy breaks up with you and it's over. You're like, Oh, my God, I just out of nowhere, and they just walk away and you're like, holy shit. The ground is the rugs pulled out under you. You're not prepared for anything. It was heart breaking by the heart. It's like gut wrenching, because you put everything into it. And then it's personal. Right? He doesn't you don't know why he's breaking up with you. Because it's only been six months if you think oh my god, right. I mean, I was changing like, my life for this guy. Like I was I sold my car because he told me his his kids hockey equipment didn't fit in my car.

Melissa Bright: 43:48

Oh my god.

Jennifer: 43:48

I mean, like, I was just so my head was so fucked up. I thought I had to do everything to keep this guy and then I was like, What are you doing? Jen? Like, my husband came over he said, What are you doing? Yeah, like you're posting pictures on Facebook with his children. Jennifer, I was like, No, no,

Melissa Bright: 44:07

right? Someone's got someone's got to pull. Yeah, that was bad. That's a that's definitely a red flag I would write for bright bright bright red. Yeah, if and that's that's a really hard thing. Like I I'm really good at being alone. Um, in terms of I've always loved being alone all the time. I don't need people around me. I don't know if that's a good thing or a bad thing either. Now I like it much better. Yeah, but I've man like I really did enjoy being single and I didn't need someone but I did pray. Like I did pray one time I said, you know God, if you are going to have me be in a relationship, please let this person loves me for me and all this stuff. And that's why I do have Brandon in my life. But that is huge. Because I see people all the time that just just sprint into the next relationship because they can't have that alone time. And that is like the first freakin clue that you got to learn some stuff about yourself to be able to be able to be okay. And I mean, I'm sure there's some guys that like needy girls and want to like save them but

Jennifer: 45:14

that was my guy. That's what he did. He swooped right in. And he was like, they look for vulnerable women, and a lot of men. Look for women who are coming with a lot of like, they know they're getting a lot of alimony. They know that. Oh, my god, they're there. And also men. A lot of men do that mean, they really do jump into there. You see them jump really quickly to relationships really, even faster than women. Most women take their time. They're not impulsive. men go marriage relationship. Boom. They're the ones who can't be alone. Yeah, they're the ones so but women be careful because men prey prey. Not all of them. Of course, I'm generalizing. But Ryan prey on vulnerable women who are sad, distraught, coming out of like, you know, right. Big, big marriages have huge lifestyles that are going to allow them like, situation they know they've they've had this glorious, watch. Careful.

Melissa Bright: 46:12

Right. That's, that's very good to know. What do you feel is the key to any successful relationship?

Jennifer: 46:22

This is easy communication. Number one, communicate. Does everyone see that? dedication and then sex? But yeah, when it comes in then the other right. No pun intended. Right. Yeah, communication. I mean, it's just if you can't communicate, there's a complete breakdown of everything. I mean, that's it, right? I mean, it's tough. It's tough. Because once you stop that, once you stop that, you know, communicate once you stop communicating you Where do you write, it's hard to? It's hard to get it back. Yeah, I love there's a little thing I do. That I learned from my coach, because coaches need coaches, I think but yeah, he taught us. He does it with his actually with his wife or his girlfriend. Every night before we go to bed. And we don't do this enough. We do three things. So we get better else we do it with like a glass of wine, whatever. What was the best part of our day? What was the next best part of our day? And what's something we want to work on?

Melissa Bright: 47:19

Is this with each other? Yep. Like, what was the best part of your day with you? What was the worst part or in general,

Jennifer: 47:26

more general or whatever, but just and you have to be like, open to listening. So it can't be like a start of a fight. It can't be something defensive. So you have to have like a safe space. So like, let's say that Brandon said, The worst part of my day was was coming home to a messy house. You can't be like, why was Magnus messy? Because I wasn't. Okay, you have to save space.

Melissa Bright: 47:46

Yeah, that's really good. What if Okay, cuz sometimes men, I don't want to like they're not like, Oh, yeah, let's talk about feelings and do all this. That sounds great. Like, can I watch some sports? Maybe give them a reward? Okay, okay. Okay. Okay.

Jennifer: 48:04

Maybe involved a little bribe? Maybe? Maybe if you do it every night for maybe if you do it three times a week? There's a special sex. Yeah, you know, reward on the weekend? Yeah, I don't know.

Melissa Bright: 48:14

I feel like that's one of the hardest things and and something that has really shifted in our relationship prior to 2018 2018 was the great breakup that like lasted three months, and we were certain we were never going to get back together. Before 2018 we were not communicating like okay at all. Now we we communicate like we actually talking it, it's been so much better. So I feel though whenever you have those people and I don't want to say men or whatever, it's just easy. Yeah, that's when they're not open to open up open to doing these things to doing these practices or these games or whatever. Like, what, what do you do when they're like no honey, like, that sounds stupid or silly like my boyfriend. Prior to 2018 I asked him to read the book, The Five Love Languages, and he was not about it. Now he still hasn't read it, but he totally gets it like holy shit. This is where she's coming from. Okay, so I just said a lot right there. But well, it's somebody that's not willing to

Jennifer: 49:23

what you did it, you did exactly what you're supposed to do. You read the book, and you went to him and you gave him this cliff notes version, right?

Melissa Bright: 49:30

Look, my Not me, not me, because he does good now, like he really. But for any, like any guy or girl in general, are willing to be like, I'm stupid. I'm not willing to do that or whatever I don't want to

Jennifer: 49:44

write you do the cliffnotes version. So like, My boyfriend is never reading a book. He's never reading a book on relationships. He's not right. I will give him the like, I'll break it down for him. And he'll hear it like out of one side of his ear. You see I'm saying like, I don't listen to a podcast or It was or I'll make them out. But like, you're right, you can't, there's only so much you can you can't put you can't push, right? Most relationships get to the point where it's so bad that one of the one has to threaten the other. Well, if you don't go to, if we don't go to therapy I'm leaving. Or, you know, it's just so bad that you don't want it ever get that bad, right? You just don't.

Melissa Bright: 50:21

Yeah, cuz I've seen relationships where one person is willing, they're like, I want to save my marriage. I want to do this, but the other person one hasn't seen any problems. They're like, What are you talking about? And I'm like, You're fucking miserable. Like, you know what we're talking about? You just don't want it to admit it. Right? She does. That has to be really, really defeating for a person that wants to give their all. So what do you say for people that like, I want to try want to try I want to try but the other person is like one they won't even recognize there's an issue and I don't have anything wrong. Like, there's nothing wrong with me. You're the problem.

Jennifer: 50:56

Well, if that's happening, if someone's saying there's nothing wrong with me, you're the problem. If that's coming out of anyone's mouth in a relationship, that's a problem. Yep. In itself. Okay. That is a huge red flag and that a neck? I hate the word. I hate the overdiagnosis of narcissists. Okay. You know, I've don't, the DSM, the whole, whatever, only like point one something crazy percent of people are, are really narcissistic. Okay, I really, like narcissistic behavior disorder diagnosed. I hate Google, I hate Web MD. People need to go to a doctor and get diagnosed by but their people have narcissistic tendencies or personal traits, or characteristics. That is one. If you can't hold yourself accountable for anything in a relationship, if you can't take blame for anything, if you think it's everyone else's fault. Those three things 123 are huge red flags for narcissistic behavior issues now. If anytime, so if anyone's listening to this, and your if your boyfriend girlfriend is saying it's not my problem without me, I didn't do it. Or, you know, this is about your Yeah. Yeah, that is a problem. Right? That is a problem if someone comes to you in a safe space. And I also believe that like a lot of times that happens when you bombard the person, right? You come in with with guns blazing, you're like, I need to talk to you. We have no, you just set a time you to be you know, I'm the worst at this. But like, hey, Jim, you're probably busy right now. But is there a time today that we can talk about a couple things that are that are kind of, you know, maybe bothering me, right? Give him some time to process? He says, Yeah, you know, you're right. I'm at work right now. I can't talk. But yeah, let's back five o'clock is good, whatever, make a date to talk about things also do check in every week. You know, maybe like every Sunday night. Yeah, check in and say look, what are we good this week or any issues? That brings down the right to the levels too, right?

Melissa Bright: 52:58

That's good. Okay, so I'm still bouncing all over. I'm still kind of bouncing all over the place. But that's okay. Because I feel like everybody's kind of getting a little bit of something. So what are the ingredients? I guess is the only word I could come up with for that to my book. Did you read my book? That's a typo. No, I did not my secret sauce. Oh, yes. Okay, well, I got to ask you what that is, but we'll come back to that. So let me write your question. You're gonna say, what is the what is the ingredients to a doomed relationship? Like, when should people going? Like, doomed? I don't know. I like, if somebody is like, there's parts they want to hold on to and parts that they're like, I just don't see this getting any better. So what are in Okay, obviously, the non negotiables would be physical men. Yes, you Yeah. But if there's anything else that kind of jumps out at you that it's like, Yeah,

Jennifer: 53:52

well, what you said before? I mean, if one person is willing to work on it, and the other person is not in, you're at a standstill. I mean, it's just a matter of time before one of you before you're going to leave. Yeah. I mean, you cannot be in a relationship where one person because you're just gonna get so frustrated, it's gonna end. I mean, you're never gonna, it's never gonna never gonna be fixed. I mean, that is definitely like, I mean, how can you be in a relationship with the person that you are with is not willing to try or we're not willing to work on you're not willing to be approachable or thinks that there's nothing wrong or is ignoring the, you know, your feelings? Because basically, when someone is saying, I'm sorry, not working on it, they're saying, I don't care about you. Right? There. They're saying, You're not important enough to me to fix our relationship. I mean, that's awful. Awful. That's,

Melissa Bright: 54:45

that's more or less what you're what you're saying. And that's, that's so true, because I feel like some people do stay in relationships much longer than they should because their denial, they think it can get better or whatever. And so I just kind of wanted to ask that question of like, maybe somebody needs To hear it like, Oh shit, this is my girlfriend like she doesn't think she has a problem or whatever. And that's stuff with me like I had to get real freakin honest with myself because I've had people just people don't see relationships, like me and Brandon's relationship, if we're out to dinner or something like that, they're like, oh, Melissa and Brandon are great, but they don't see psycho Melissa, like snap, yelling or screaming, but I think like, oh, Melissa is like a great girlfriend. And that's when I had to get honest with myself because I'm like, No, guys, you don't understand you don't see me freakin flip my lid on Brandon for no reason or whatever. And it's kind of has caused some some issues in my own family that people for whatever thought that like, stuff. Brandon was a certain way. And I'm like, you guys have it. So beyond wrong, like I'm the one that has more fucked up issues. Yeah, yeah. And Brandon. And it just gets kind of like, frustrating. But, um,

Jennifer: 56:02

well, it's funny, because you never really know what's going on, right behind closed doors. And I feel like we're a lot of like, I just might, I'm reacting to my boyfriend's like, what the actual, like, you know, I'm using up my meds on any job. I have. I mean, I, it's just my personality. I'm like, just so and he's used to no reaction like he's used to like, he is just he is just calm. Like he is we are here. So when he sees me like I'm a yeller, I go from zero to 16. He said, You know, like, he just retracts like a turtle in a shell. Yeah. And I'm just like, boom. So it's hard. It is hard. But it I think you said something before, and I was gonna say something. Oh, the only way to stay in a relationship with someone who doesn't want to fix it is it's for you to ignore all the issues.

Melissa Bright: 56:51

Yeah, and that's not gonna work.

Jennifer: 56:53

So if you want to be complacent, ignore everything. Not, you know, walk around feeling like you're walking on eggshells. Not being true to who you are being facetious, right? But then you'll stay. Yep. But then you need to do work on yourself. Meaning you the general, you because why would you want? What does that say about you? Right? You need to own your stone, your shit and stand up for yourself and say, I'm not going to be treated this way. And if you don't care enough about me to do the work, then I'm leaving. Yeah, I'm leaving.

Melissa Bright: 57:26

Yep. Great advice. Great advice. Okay, so you said something about your secret sauce. Why? You said that. You said Oh, yeah. What's the ingredients for?

Jennifer: 57:37

Mine is what's in greensborough a perfectly healthy relationship or a six by eight. What is it before I do the four S's for a successful relationship in my book? Do you remember I remember now it's been so hard. What the fuck Hello?

Melissa Bright: 57:53

Can I guess one is one says? Of course. Of course.

Jennifer: 57:56

That's the biggest one sex and intimacy. Oh, speak less and listen more. Oh, yeah, speak less and listen more. That's a good one for the for you know, because

Melissa Bright: 58:06

I will speak way more and don't need to at all.

Jennifer: 58:08

I don't either. And it's about your tone. Also, like changing the tone of your voice when you're speaking because i'm not i'm so nasty sometimes. Oh, smiling and being nice. Like being kind, just being kind to each other. Like, I'm such a bitch. I was such a bitch in my marriage. I was like, the bitchiest that you ever met. And my husband would come home from the end of the day. He's like, I don't really want to come home. You're just such a bitch. I'm like, well, I've been with these kids all day. You know what it's like? And I'm like, who want to come home to that? Right? Right? Yep. Got 100 this is gonna start a whole other thing. I don't know if we want to go here. But maybe not. Put your kids second. And your relationship first. It's a big one. Yeah, people yell at me when I'm speaking on the country. They're like, What do you mean? Put your kids second. I'm like, if you want a relationship, the last thing you want to stay married. You have to I was talking to my kids first. Right? I hope that everybody taught you put your kids first your kids come first. My kids came out of my vagina and my husband went second. My kids were first. Alright. That's why I'm divorced. I'm not sure of it. All. I cared about my kids.

Melissa Bright: 59:06

Right? It makes sense. Because that's why people always say you have to take care of yourself before you can take care of anybody else. If you're not taking care of yourself, if your cup is empty, if your mental health is not on point, if whatever. It's not going to be good. I had a lot of issues back in 2018. Like I was upset that I gained, like weight. And so a lot of my insecurities if Brandon would say anything, like not demeaning at all, but I would snap on him and he's like, You're not even mad about me. You are mad about something that's internally you're upset about. If you're mad at yourself about or whatever.

Jennifer: 59:41

It's like the airplane where they say to put your mask on first before you sit down. Yeah,

Melissa Bright: 59:45

yep, exactly. Yeah, that's the best. That's the best way so that's exactly why she's saying it and I agree. 100% so all you people that think that I see exactly why you said that. Yeah, yeah, definitely. Okay, so What is something that women need to know about men? And then we're gonna do vice versa? What is something that men need to know about women? Oh my god, this is all in Jennifer's opinion, like,

Jennifer: 1:00:18

Oh, this is actually research base to have something for you. Women you need to know about men, they would rather have they this is this is true. They will take confidence over like, pretty, like do something if someone they want competent, competent a competent woman is like a woman they would choose every time. Yep. Like not that they don't want pretty but of course, but like confidence is huge, huge. And it's the hardest characteristic to find in a woman. For men. They say that it's really difficult for them to fight. Yeah, like, because I think we're also women are so we're also insecure, right? I mean, like, as competent as I think I am. I'm like, to just say that about my, like, it's hard.

Melissa Bright: 1:01:07

It's what it's what my boyfriend says all the time. If I'm insecure about our relationship or myself, like he hates if I do any negative self talk, he is like, stop right now. But that's the He's like, cuz sometimes I'm like, are you okay? And he's like, he thinks that's me asking him like I'm insecure about our relationship. And I'm like, No, I'm literally asking you if you're okay. Like literally like, are you? Okay? Yeah. So that's huge. Confidence is huge. And sometimes like that's, and when I'm not feeling confident, that's when I'm the bitchiest and grouchiness and he knows it. He'll call me on my shit. He's like,

Jennifer: 1:01:42

Oh, good for him. I want to meet this guy. And it's funny, like, men will say to me when I'm coaching, and I say like, what are you looking for in a woman? And they're like, confidence. It's so funny to me. You really want a confident woman? And how do I? How do I find that for a guy like is gonna say I'm insecure? You know, right? When I'm betting when I'm betting?

Melissa Bright: 1:02:01

That is very true. That is very true. Okay, so now, vice versa. What do we need to know for? What are men? Men need to know? Wait, what do men need to know about women? Or what I meant to mention about women? Um, oh, yeah. Yep. Good guy.

Jennifer: 1:02:22

Wait, is that right? Women need to know about men? Yeah, we just said, Okay, what do men each other women think of a good one. Good. We're not all crazy. I hate that.

Melissa Bright: 1:02:32

I hate that. I hate that. I think that I have realized and you tell me if this is one that men are fixers, and they they like to fix things. And so whenever you whenever you go at them with a problem, sometimes you're not always looking for advice, but they're always looking to fix.

Jennifer: 1:02:50

I have to preface everything. Know what I say now. I'm like, none of this. Just listen. That's my little hand signals. He's like, okay, okay. I'm like, Jim, please. I don't want you to sit. I don't want your opinion. I just want you to listen. It's like, Okay, I got it. I got it. You just sit there so hard for him. He has to learn. You can see him like going like this. Because he just wants to fix everything for me. Yeah. And it's like, no, so nice. But the same time, he never says what I wanted to say. Because, you know, I'm saying I'm like, that is not how we I would fix it. You know what I mean? Like, I know what, I'm so pissed or whatever it is. And he's trying to fix it. making it worse. Yeah, I mean,

Melissa Bright: 1:03:26

yep. It's huge. And I heard from something else and I forgot that every there's like a husband and wife that do this. And when they like they do preface it. They're like, I don't, I'm not telling you to fix this. I'm just telling you, but they say like a certain word. And that really does help.

Jennifer: 1:03:43

Because that's the guys that got Gatlin the goblins. Maybe. Yeah, I love them.

Melissa Bright: 1:03:49

Maybe, but it's so true. Cuz I know that Brandon, anytime I'm upset about something, he wants to try to fix it and he's gonna, he loves his own way. But I'm like, I don't need you to fix it. I just need you to fucking Listen to me vent or be pissed off or

Jennifer: 1:04:03

whatever. Just, you know, I want him I want him to like, they always want to play devil's advocate. And I'm like, just agree with me. I don't care what even if she's the worst human in the world, or, you know, the best human whatever. And I just say what I just said, but I want to hear, just say I'm gonna call my girlfriend now because she'll tell me that you don't lie to me. For God's sakes, right?

Melissa Bright: 1:04:22

Yeah. Oh, 100% because they're, oh my gosh, I just lost my train of thought. They're logical. There's so much like more logical, so they're just Yes. Oh, yes.

Jennifer: 1:04:32

We got the fact they give you the facts. Right. Like you screwed this up. And did I'm like,

Melissa Bright: 1:04:37

Yep, exactly. Exactly. Let's talk a little bit about your podcast called doing relationships. Right. So obviously set the name of the podcast but what are some of your topics that you discuss on besides religion? Obviously,

Jennifer: 1:04:55

what are the topics? Um, it's funny because you know, used to be doing divorce right and I was just in January, I decided I was so scared to do it. But I decided to change because I was changing from divorce to relationships. I'm like, it doesn't make sense anymore. So I changed to doing relationships, right, which totally freaked me out because I was like, I'm gonna lose everybody, no one's gonna want. And it just opened a whole new world. So I'm so grateful to my listeners. And it's like, I just love it. I know you love it, too. You love the podcast? It's like your jam. Yeah, so we talk about everything I'm really into. Lately, I want to start talking more about sex positivity, and sex positive stuff, and which is kind of like, I'm reading a lot of it lately. And I kind of kind of dig it. And we talked about mental health. And we talked a lot about, you know, marriage and how to stay married and how not you know what to do with divorce. And that can co parenting. self love. You know, anything that has to with any relationship, basically anything so right. It's good, good stuff. I

Melissa Bright: 1:05:55

love it. Yeah. So if you guys want to check out her podcast, it's called doing relationships. Right? It's It's so fun. And you should definitely go check it out. Just really quickly, I wanted to ask you, because you said sex positivity. I don't know what that is.

Jennifer: 1:06:10

What is my gosh, let's do come on, we'll do a show. So it's not it's not that you like love to have sex all the time, and you're swinging from the rafters and your legs are always open? Because someone said that you're like, well, I don't agree with having sex in the first date. I'm like, No, this is sex positive. If you're sex positive, which I am, I'm sex positive means that you are open to talking about sex. You're positive about sex, your language is positive about sex. And you're also open to people. You know, talking about gender and gender fluidity, and, you know, sharing their their coming out what's the word? their opinion? Okay. And exploring exploration. As long as it's in, you know, your you're no one's oppression? You sure? Does that make sense? like yours? Yeah. It's the same. Okay, gotcha. Yeah. I just know, like I talked about with my kids, and I want them to be set, you know? Right.

Melissa Bright: 1:07:00

That's awesome. See, I learned something new every day. Every day. It's a new buzzword. It is it is all the new buzzwords. Okay. I just have a couple more questions for you. And these are going to, they might be easier. They might not hard, or might be hard. But what does Jennifer want people to know about? We're going to this is going to be three different seats, three of the same questions. But what is Jennifer want people to know about dating, just dating and then we're gonna go to relationship and then divorce? What

Jennifer: 1:07:32

do you want? Okay, about dating. Yep. about dating? Well, obviously, that it should be fun. And then it's not as it's not as hard as that as people make it out to be. And that you're gonna find your person that you that you will, you'll find your person. It's just you know, what you've you've just got to keep going and be positive. And nobody wants to date a nasty person. So show up and be be positive and be happy. And just that's it. You know, I think positivity is key. Yes. You know?

Melissa Bright: 1:08:06

Yes, that is great answer. All right. Jennifer, what do you want people to know about relationships?

Jennifer: 1:08:12

This is my, this is my thing. This is my motto. tell everyone about relationships. It's not about finding the right person. It's about being the right person.

Melissa Bright: 1:08:23

Mind blown. That's a good mind.

Jennifer: 1:08:26

Match. I had a friend who said that to me once and I was like, Can I use that? And he's like, no, genuine. So there's a long time ago, David glass, a good friend of mine. So yeah, good one.

Melissa Bright: 1:08:35

I love it there. I keep talking about mine and Brandon's relationship and something that I had. Yeah, I had to learn early on was something that he said to me that really resonated with me was Melissa, I love you unconditionally. And you only love me conditionally. Like, you only love me when I was doing this. And I'm doing this and I'm doing this. And that. I had to like, really think about that. And I was like, Oh, shit. He's kind of right. Like,

Jennifer: 1:09:01

sounds like you have a really good guy.

Melissa Bright: 1:09:02

He is great guy. And he has a whole hell of a lot more of grace than I do. Like, I feel about my guy too. Yeah. And I like a lot. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. And so that's, that's really, really good. Okay, what do you Jennifer want people to know about divorce?

Jennifer: 1:09:18

Oh, divorce is not the end of your life. That divorce is it's not the end of it doesn't have to be a disaster. Divorce does not have to be a disaster. It can be a start of a new beginning. How about that? It can be started. You can you can move into, you know, a whole new life. You can turn your divorce into a career like me.

Melissa Bright: 1:09:42

Yeah. And we could talk all about that about everything with divorce. And we know it's not an easy topic, but people do survive after divorce. And just like Jennifer, she made a whole career out of it, which is incredible. Incredible. Thank you. So if people wanted to use you as a dating coach and relationship expert. How can people get in touch with you?

Jennifer: 1:10:06

It's so easy. Once they it's Jennifer hurvitz.com. There we go. Everything's there. And I'm on Instagram and Facebook and Twitter and Pinterest in. Yes.

Melissa Bright: 1:10:15

I love it. I just followed you on Pinterest by the way back. Perfect. I love it there. Oh, I know. I'm trying to learn. I love it there. But I got to learn how to like work in there. Oh my gosh. Oh my goodness. So yeah, everybody go to her website. And she has all of her stuff there. She has wonderful. We met on clubhouse followed each other on Instagram. And she has such a fun Instagram, but she's everywhere. And it's it's a lot of fun stuff. I reposted one year things about yesterday when I said I was interviewing a relationship expert. I didn't see I posted I pictures. No, I didn't I just posted in the story. Oh, but people like laughed at it because it was it was the one and do you want to know? I don't even remember what it was. But it was one of the funny posts that you make? And I'm like, Oh, I find them and I'm like, I wish I would have said that. But you know, it's something I do something I don't. It's great. Okay. And I just have one last question for you, Jennifer, in your own words. What does the bright side of life mean to you? Oh,

Jennifer: 1:11:19

I don't know why I'm getting emotional. It's like I listened to your show. The bright side of life. It's just about your show or in general,

Melissa Bright: 1:11:28

about and in general. What does it mean to you if people I mean, nobody asked you which I am asking you. What is the ride of life mean to Jennifer?

Jennifer: 1:11:40

I think it's just you know, I always think of positivity. And lately, picking yourself up putting two feet on the floor. And just doing one day I'm gonna cry. I don't know why I'm crying. Do one day at a time. Just do one day to time to one day at a time.

Melissa Bright: 1:11:57

I love it.

Jennifer: 1:11:58

I love it. I love you. I just feel like you're amazing. Thanks.

Melissa Bright: 1:12:01

Oh, well, so are you. It's what you know, honestly, if people cry all the time on this show. I do. It's it's kind of supposed to happen. So we just I wasn't I wasn't prepared. So that's okay. Well, Jennifer, thank you so, so much for such a wonderful episode. And in talking with me, we could talk about dating and relationships and divorce and sex and everything else. I might have to have you on my podcast again,

Jennifer: 1:12:28

anytime you combine to please because we could we could talk all about that. Thank you,

Melissa Bright: 1:12:34

all you lovely people for listening to this week's episode of the bright side of life. I hope you guys enjoyed Jennifer's story. Jennifer's advice. I know we kind of bounced around when we were talking about dating and then we talk about marriage and then we talk about divorce. But I kind of wanted to give you guys all all the things because we've might have done all three or we've Meinl only done one. So I wanted to kind of touch on all of those. So I hope you guys enjoyed today's episode. I know I did miss last week, I was on vacation in Montana, with my brother and my family and got to spend some time up there. So I apologize for missing last week. And lastly, I do want to ask, we're almost a year into me podcasting. And I would love it love it love it. If you guys could write me a review, you guys can either do so directly at the bright side of life podcast comm or you guys can go to Apple podcast and write a review there. I also wanted to mention that I am a part of bar buy me a coffee, which is basically a creator fund that you can donate to creators like myself, and that is just to help with monthly subscriptions and things like that to keep the future of the bright side of life going. Other than that, guys, you know how this goes. If you or anyone you know needs to hear Jennifer's story or her advice. Please share it with them, because we never know if this is the one that puts hope back in their heart.